Lip Service.
Mind the Peripherals.


  • December 21, 2017 at 12:03 am

    Very interesting! New twist!


    • December 21, 2017 at 10:28 am

      In who’s gun?

  • December 21, 2017 at 12:12 am

    41.0 grains perhaps. 410 grains of powder would equal – the most compressed load ever and that seems to be at about the speed suggested as 44 grains is about 2780 fps.

    • December 21, 2017 at 10:54 am

      40 Grains seems about right, decimal points are tricky things. According to the IMR website, 40 grains of H322 with a 150 grain bullet should yield around 2,702 FPS. Note: This is a maximum load.

      As stated by others 410 grains won’t fit and if it did, you would be eating a “Gun Sandwich” for lunch, at best.

  • December 21, 2017 at 12:22 am

    41.0 grains?

  • December 21, 2017 at 12:38 am

    Is that supposed to be 41.0 grains of powder? I would think 410 grains wouldn’t fit in a .308 casing.

    • December 21, 2017 at 12:42 am


    • December 21, 2017 at 12:45 am

      That would be correct, Stryker.


      • December 21, 2017 at 1:01 am
        Chris Muir

        yup.Got it outta Hodgdon’s, but left out the decimal.I’ll just leave it as it is.

    • December 21, 2017 at 8:03 am

      Nanopowder. 😉

  • December 21, 2017 at 1:19 am
    JackDeth 72

    Nicely done, Chris:

    Where are Zed and Sam’s lovely twin daughters, Caroline and Catherine for a wonderful Family Together Time Outing like this?

  • December 21, 2017 at 1:27 am

    Happiness is a warm .338 Lapua ……….

  • December 21, 2017 at 1:52 am

    Nice to see a bunch of reloaders chime in. In .308, I am partial to Varget and Sierra 155 grain palma. My last retail employment was at Huntington’s in Oroville, CA. As in Fred Huntington, founder of RCBS. How about some specs on Sam’s shootin’ iron?

    • December 21, 2017 at 9:17 am

      Agree. I get my best 7.62 results with Varget, followed closely by N202. I’m shooting a gas gun, which likes medium speed powders and medium charges, so YRMV. Also, my rifle likes 168s – no matter what I do, I can’t get the cheaper 150s to shoot anywhere near as well as the 168s.

      • December 21, 2017 at 12:24 pm

        Possibly due to the twist rate. My .30-06 likes 165gr Rem Core-Lokt bullets. 3 shots covered by a nickel at 100 yards. 150s opened it up to a quarter. 180s it takes a silver dollar. One of the big ones.

  • December 21, 2017 at 2:00 am

    Single grain works as well as the others. Megacheers, everyone.

    • December 21, 2017 at 7:48 am
      Heath Jayman

      Single malt, too.

    • December 21, 2017 at 9:55 am

      I think you meant ‘single base’.

  • December 21, 2017 at 2:15 am

    A lot of us seem to have noticed that missing decimal. Good load aside from that.

  • December 21, 2017 at 2:26 am

    I’m partial to a 168 grain Sierra Match King with 43.0 grains of 4895. There’s a lot to be said for the M2 AP load, too.

    • December 21, 2017 at 8:08 am

      You would like the Privi match load then. 🙂
      Has outperformed Fed GMM consistently, a nice surprise.

  • December 21, 2017 at 6:32 am
    Alious Rex


    • December 21, 2017 at 12:25 pm


  • December 21, 2017 at 6:51 am
    Doc Savage

    She did it…..she went full ballistic math.

    I’m in love.

  • December 21, 2017 at 6:55 am

    That view of Sam brought something to mind that I wanted to comment on earlier.

    Thanks for Sam Redvolution lens cloth in the batch of stuff sent, but it doesn’t work. Smears the lens, doen’t clean it.

    Probably would help if I didn’t drool when i see it.

    • December 21, 2017 at 8:11 am

      That’s not a lens cloth, it’s a nakk’n. :oP

  • December 21, 2017 at 7:48 am

    That view of Sam is medicine for my soul.

    • December 21, 2017 at 10:02 am

      I applaud Zed’s discipline. There is no way I would be looking down range with that view in front of me.

      • December 21, 2017 at 10:50 am
        MAJ Arkay

        Well, Zed *does* get to see the unclad version every day…

  • December 21, 2017 at 7:54 am
    Steven Speairs

    I hope that I can be permitted to go off-thread to mark a significant anniversary. 49 years ago, after an awful 1968 that had assassinations and center-city destroying riots, Apollo 8 launched this day for the first mission that went beyond Earth’s gravity. While orbiting the Moon on Christmas Eve, the three astronauts, Frank Borman, James Lovell & William Anders, read from the Book of Genesis about the creation of the Earth & Firmament! You can see & hear this broadcast from the NASA web site.

    • December 21, 2017 at 10:25 am

      Thanks for reminding us. I remember our listening to that. Exciting, and a bit moving hearing Genesis from space.

  • December 21, 2017 at 8:44 am
    James Flanagan

    As a fellow Flanagan, I now feel even more kinship with that sassy redhead.

    Continue the fight against the minions of ObamaLoki!

  • December 21, 2017 at 10:27 am
    Spin Drift

    A 168 BTSP with a high BC out of a M70 30-06 being pushed by Hodgson’s Superperformance Powder will give closer to 3000 fps. Flattens out the arc and extends usable kill range to the next area code.

    Spin Drift
    All I felt was the recoil.
    Still not a good as a .338 Lapua for reaching out and touching someone

  • December 21, 2017 at 10:54 am

    I prefer a 168 Gr. Hornady Match, over 41.5 Gr of Varget… Half inch groups at 200 yards. That’s 1/4 MOA guys. Not too bad for a 20″ barrel Tikka.

  • December 21, 2017 at 11:52 am
    Chris Muir

    A Correction! According to the Hodgon reloading site, it shouldn’t exceed 40.0 grains. And at that loading from a 24″ barrel, the velocity should be 2,702 ft/s.

  • December 21, 2017 at 12:03 pm

    Hmmmm I know where the 2500 foot distant objective IS.
    But where is that objective gonna’ be in about a second?
    What’s gonna’ be in line, behind it?
    (mmmm barometric pressure/ temperature/prevailing breeze…..ugh, shouldn’t have had that burrito for lunch!)

  • December 21, 2017 at 12:45 pm

    i prefer BL-C2 myself… good all around powder for .308, 30.06 and 8mm Mauser.

  • December 21, 2017 at 12:47 pm

    Buncha nerds.

    Made a good living off guys and gals like y’all for 40 years. How often can you say that when you were doing and dealing with things, people, and philosophy that you love and would have done for fun and for free anyway?

    While there were (and are) a few knucklehead know-it-alls (know-nothings) and dangerous mall-cop/sheepdog types, I gotta say the gunnie community is on the whole the most inclusive, caring, giving, group I ever had the pleasure to meet, deal with, and learn from (stop listening and learning and you become one of those knuckleheads I mentioned).

    The antis, lefties, and elites don’t know what they’re missing.

    Love ya.

  • December 21, 2017 at 1:32 pm

    Chris, as someone who who once changed foot pounds to feet per pound when describing a sniper rifle in a novel, you have my sympathy.

    I love gun nerds…

    But they will let you know when you miss.

    • December 21, 2017 at 3:09 pm

      Technical data to impress the readers is always a two edged sword.
      For those well versed it will delight.
      For those too serious and well versed it causes anguish.
      And that doesn’t include artistic license like Arthur C. Clarke’s little fudge of moving the equator a few miles north to reach Sri Lanka.

    • December 21, 2017 at 11:47 pm

      Good to see you on board here, Holly.

      Though I don’t recall that one, so I probably wasn’t the person who pointed it out.

      • December 22, 2017 at 11:59 am

        Hey, Jim. Likewise, though I have a few friends named Jim, so while I think I know, I’m kind of guessing which one you are. Been a Chris fan for ages.

        The foot-pounds error was the Serrated Edge collab with Misty Lackey. The error was all mine, though.

  • December 21, 2017 at 2:10 pm

    What is Sam shooting at that requires a load like that?
    Is Christmas Dinner still roaming the range?
    Or some wayward sheep humpers needing a lesson in manners?

  • December 21, 2017 at 2:43 pm

    “And at that loading from a 24″ barrel, the velocity should be 2,702 ft/s.”

    OK, but there’s no real “maths” for figuring that out. At best the internal ballistics maths would give a very rough estimate. Actual pressure and velocity are determined in testing, and vary from one barrel to another. The real maths comes in figuring your trajectory, which, given enough atmospheric data, can be very precise. See

    Someone in the field isn’t using maths, at least not in the sense that he’s doing the calculus in his head. He’s going on previous experience regarding bullet drop at various distances, for his rifle, with his load, under various conditions, relative to his sight’s zero. He’s using tables, either memorized or written down and kept with the rifle.

    Determining the actual distance to the target is key in that situation, if it’s a long shot, so he may be wanting a laser rangefinder. A mil dot scope reticle, or other subtension based range finding system, will do also, if the size of the target is known, but a laser is quick and precise.

  • December 21, 2017 at 6:09 pm
    Spin Drift

    The ability to distance is the key. I’m passing my own event horizon in the fact that my rifles are getting better than me. It’s a heck of a thing to confront that which was second nature now takes concentration and outright thought. I can still do it but the quickness is abating. Luckily the mind is still sharp and I can OODA loop my way through a situation. As I was telling the special snowflake, don’t underestimate an old guy with an engineering degree.

    Don’t run boy, you’ll just die tired.
    War Damn Eagle

    • December 21, 2017 at 7:33 pm

      I can still hit a barn door.If it’s closed.From the the inside.

      • December 21, 2017 at 8:31 pm

        At least you can see the barn door. I have to work by feel…

      • December 21, 2017 at 10:45 pm

        AHEM !!!

      • December 21, 2017 at 11:28 pm
  • December 21, 2017 at 7:48 pm
    Alex J

    I was trying to figure out the weight of the bullet that Sam and Zed we’re using. From my limited non-existent knowledge, the weight of the bullet going downrange has some effect on terminal velocity. I know it has an effect on windage.

    • December 21, 2017 at 10:55 pm
      Spin Drift

      Bullets have Ballistic Coefficients (BC) that are used to determine trajectory. Shape, diameter and weight are all used in the calculation. As the saying goes, velocity peters out but BC carries all the way to the target.

      Spin Drift
      Happy Winter Soltice

  • December 21, 2017 at 8:38 pm

    No problems Chris. We reloaders see differences in various reloading manuals all the time. To the point that most use the manuals as a good starting point to match each load to the gun and sometimes exceed published limits if the rifle tolerates it. ..Ballistics can be interesting.

  • December 25, 2017 at 7:37 pm

    You might find H4895 44 gr. (or IMR 4064 44.9gr.), 168Gg Aluminum tipped RBT from Alco Bullets an interesting combination for flat shooting…

15 49.0138 8.38624 1 0 4000 1 300 0